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Comment by JL Gawlik on March 6, 2011 at 12:05pm

Very interesting discussion. Funny how my family's instincts/gut feelings felt something has not been right for over a decade, and the feeling got worst that something was wrong, the feeling grew stronger even more in 2007 to Fall of 2008, the feelings are still there, something is amiss. We couldn't put our finger on it but now we can see that everything is being manipulated through lies and twisted facts. We are finding out more and more people have experienced the same thing.

A progressive liberal/socialist progressive can not sell you their point of view, to take away your liberties, freedoms and our U.S. Constitution. What American in their right mind would give all of that up? They must lie, and deceive. Just as the Communist/Socialist in the mid 20th Century relabeled themselves Progressives, when they saw that the American people were NOT going to accept Socialist or Communist candidates or ideologue.

Going through the sites that John posted i found this site: http://cafr1.com/

Interesting to note that the quote at the top of that page is "Rise and rise again until lambs become lions"  It was quoted in the latest Robin Hood movie with Russell Crowe, when asked by Little John and Will Scarlet what this saying meant, Robin Hood explained something akin to Winston Churchhill, and to our American founding fathers. It means never give up for the cause of liberty, never, ever give up. Rise, and rise again, until the docile lambs become conquering lions.

The movie was directed by Ridley Scott. I feel like hints are being dropped right and left everywhere as to what is going on in our government and globally.

Just as the hints in our U.S. Constitution, put in by our founding fathers' , i read somewhere that Jefferson loved puzzles and figuring out codes, written in capital letters such as  WE THE PEOPLE.

Again it starts with the local government on up. I was very surprised to see that Jacksonville is involved with the United Nations ICLEI Global, to participate in the, Local Governments For Sustainability, Sustainable Development, Agenda 21 per Mayor John Peyton.

Web search ICLEI,  Agenda 21, Mayor John Peyton, Jacksonville FL

Lots of reading. It is so good to see people discussing all of this and sharing their finds.

Comment by J.R. on March 6, 2011 at 12:02pm

John Stephenson, there is absolutely no way you speak for 98% of the people or any percentage of those of us in the Tea Party.  And, if you're refering to Americans for Prosperity when you cite "AFP," we alread know they would never share your interests, for we know they share the Tea Party's interests and not those of a liberal infiltrator who lives to be an instrument of disruption.  Our Leadership Council has better things to do than debate a fool.  Just put a sock in it and get lost.

Comment by J.R. on March 6, 2011 at 11:37am

Sorry, William Korach, for getting your name wrong in the below comment.  Just one of those brain-slips... maybe Freudian... who knows...?

Comment by J.R. on March 6, 2011 at 10:59am

Good analogy re Enron, John Korach.  Even the notorious Bernie Madoff recently called the way our government handles the people's money a giant "Ponzi scheme."  Maybe it was his role-model...

Comment by J.R. on March 6, 2011 at 10:46am

John Harvel, you are a wealth of information on this largely hidden stealth process that is apparently designed to concentrate the vast majority of wealth in the hands of the few and unaccountable money manipulators, including the secretive Federal Reserve, Bilderburgers, and Illuminati ("the enlightened ones") in their march toward world government. I count the socialist progressives in America among those who consider themselves "enlightened" and superior, while relegating the rest of us to buffoon status and unworthy of consideration, undeserving of a constitutional and transparent democratic republic, and un-entitled to our historic rights, freedoms, and protections laid out in the Bill of Rights and U.S. Constitution. This international process appears to have been designed to operate under the radar so that the unenlightened masses don't have a clue as to why, when, where, how, and by whom they are being manipulated and fleeced. This is alarming in that they're successfully taking away our financial and military ability to protect ourselves, while at the same time attempting, through the corrupt United Nations, to establish a world-wide ban on guns so that we'll have neither the money nor the means to fight back. Meanwhile, national/international labor unions and Obama's/DNC's Organizing for America are bringing highly-organized and well-financed power into a growing sedition and anarchy movement to undermine states' sovereignty, while at the same time sucking the economy of many states dry. A combination of Obama's union/OFA brown-shirts and the blue helmets at the U.N. is a marriage made in hell. Thanks, John, for informing me and steering me to further research.

Comment by William Korach on March 6, 2011 at 8:40am

Sounds a bit like the Enron collapse and their off balance sheet entities.

Comment by John Harvel on March 6, 2011 at 7:52am

JR.. I'll make a quick comment on Ron Paul's auditing the FED. You can google the FED's CAFR and it's ownership banks. Try it, it's funny what you can find on the Internet. Here's a little fruit for thought. Dismiss it if you like. The economic collapse at the end of 2008 that ate so much wealth, was specifically due to a forced market free fall, as derivatives were used to create and profit from the collapse. Done primarily through the offshore institutional government accounts being strategically positioned in advance via derivatives initiated and placed within the stock index, interest rates, precious metals, currency, and energy markets. Those dollars didn't disappear, they changed hands.  Here they aggressively shorted several of the domestic and International markets in preparation for the planned bubble bursting in the housing market. Then, as the mortgage bubble burst, these institutional government investment accounts perpetuated the collapse through the selling of physical assets held. As trillions were lost in the market value of physical holdings, those short and strategically place long derivative positions sucked over $25 trillion of wealth out of the world population’s pockets. They did it so fast, over the course of only two months, that it destabilized the playing field, and in consideration for just having stolen $25 trillion or more, the government rammed through a trillion here and a trillion there of "tax payer revenue" through so called bailouts to shore up defaults from the intended marks that were created.  The inside players from government were  stabilizing their own stealing grounds. Then if that wasn't enough, check this out:

Click here: YouTube - fiercefreeleancer's Channel I hope all this gives you enough to think about for a while. It's time to start following the money that starts as your tax dollars and is filtered off into other peoples pockets.

Comment by John Harvel on March 6, 2011 at 5:34am

JR.. Here is part two. Keep in mind that there are over 174,000 CAFR or AFR (Annual Financial Reports) produced each year now from across the land. Think of the totals from all, many smaller and some much larger than this one. THINK OF THE COLLECTIVE COMPOSITE OWNERSHIP OUR GOVERNMENT HAS.
Click here: Untitled Document  There is no one individual government entity that will call the shots (even though some carry more clout than others) but there are private associations that network thousands of local and federal government accounts that have been assigned representative proxy vote rights for the thousands they represent and here is where the control rests. By proxy vote representing the "collective" primary shareholders they can exert pressure for that company to do as told and if not they can remove the board of directors by representative proxy vote. On the other hand they can network billions of dollars of government investment capital for direction and investment with any company. So, no matter from which side you look at it, the control factor is there.. Do a search for what financial consulting "private associations" with nice government sounding acronyms your many different local governments belongs to and the patterns of control will start coming into view. For the CAFR local government's Annual Financial Report, the two primary private associations that call the shots by direction and consult are GFOA (Government Financial Officers Association) and GASB (Government Accounting Standards Board). Find the common denominators for local government pensions (which in collective totals are in the trillions of dollars) and here is where the collective power is exerted.  Click here: Jacksonville Pension Director Says He Can Earn 8% ROI A... I have some questions at this point; what is the incentive to grow government and who benefits? Once you grasp this concept, the FED will be easier understood. 

Comment by John Harvel on March 6, 2011 at 2:26am

Congratulations JR, you have asked all of the most important questions you will ever ask. The only way to see if you are getting played with false actuarial projections applied is to look first hand and see for yourself. You do NOT ask foxes if they are eating hens from the hen house. The only time you may get a straight answer there is if you are a fox yourself and are part of the pack. Per the health care bill that just passed the syndicated media was honest per one disclosure they openly made. That being that the Pharmaceutical Companies profits will soar based on massive increases in drugs prescribed and paid for through tax payer revenue. Additionally that the insurance companies will be a big winner based on reduced liability with taxpayer revenue covering most of the liability. Now this was brought forward by the syndicated media. The common denominator having the most important reality to these statements was intentionally left out. That being: "Who owns the Pharmaceutical Companies and who was the biggest (primary) investor with the insurance companies that would greatly profit? Well, the clear answer to those questions without any question is collective government investments. The health care bill passed guarantees collective government massive profits amounting into trillions of dollars.  Prior to reading  this answer did this thought even cross your mind?  Probably not due to the fact an intentional vacuum, a void in your comprehension was promoted and maintained  DUE TO THE MONEY INVOLVED and the power and control derived therefrom. But, being that the players involved had to keep track of their own transactions a record is there for you to see "if" you know where to look to see. I won't be able to answer all your questions adequately in the confines of this blog. Here's your introduction to post grad administration: Enjoy! 
Click here: http://www.cafrman.com/Introduction.htm

Comment by J.R. on March 5, 2011 at 3:29pm

John Harvel, your explanation of the off budget assets owned by various levels of government is extremely interesting.  Could you possibly explain more fully about how those assets are held, what guarantees are in place to protect those assets, who is accountable for the management of those assets, and is information about those assets public information that is readily available to American citizens and taxpayers?  While studying public administration in grad school, I took a course in finanancial administration, but never learned of the CAFR second set of books for off-budget assets that was mandated by Eisenhower's EO a great many years earlier.  I'd also like to know what checks and balances are used that identify exactly how this money is dispensed and for what it is dispensed.  I might guess, for instance, what an off-budget pharmaceutical account might cover, but doing so would be a fool's exercise.  To me, just the idea of government-sanctioned off-budget accounts the general public largely knows and understands nothing about, goes against the grain of our expectations that government's actions be transparent and visibly accountable.  I'm a strong believer in the public's right to know, since that money is the people's money... not the government's. 

Another question:  Does the secretive and unaccountable Federal Reserve have a role in this and, if so, how?  U.S Sen. Ron Paul is pushing for an audit of the Federal Reserve.  Perhaps we need a forensic audit of both the Fed and all of these off-budget accounts and have the results required to be made available to the public.  Maybe that's something that should be combined with a mandated requirement for a balanced budget, which I believe to be something that should be required at all levels of government.

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