Comment

Comment by Tim Clark on October 7, 2011 at 1:24pm

"The goal of Socialism is Communism." Lenin

Comment by JL Gawlik on October 7, 2011 at 1:18pm

Amanda, i will proudly say my children do not support the day of rage period. They are personally shocked at what the Progressive Liberal Democrats have done to our country period. You again are putting all in one group. Many Children, grandchildren are fed up with the Progressive Liberal groups who are destroying our country and it's foundation. Fortunately they have been educated in our US  history, the history of the world, our Founding Fathers' history and Charters of Liberty and Freedom.

Comment by Steve Tikas on October 7, 2011 at 1:15pm

JL I agree with what you are saying here but please keep in mind that many of the dishonorable, dishonest, immoral, unethical, unconscionable things that have been done have been done by the right as well as the left.  Our founding fathers are truly rolling over and vomiting in their collective graves at what this country has become. 

 

Our government is no longer for the people or by the people it is for the corporations bought by the corporations that is what the movement started on.  Yes I agree it has turned into mostly stupid college kids, and now corrupt labor unions but the movement originally started due to the corruption between politicians and our corporations that fund our elected officials.  It is a joke if you think that your one vote means anything to the millions that get pumped in by the corporations. 

 

Our only chance is to stop arguing and realize what is really destroying this country, and sorry it is not the people on wall street, they are a symptom of the problem not the problem itself.  Once we come together and make it not just our one vote but our many votes and we get the corrupt politicians from both sides out of Washington then we can start to take our country back.

 

To the article post by Mr. Honiker this quote stands out "topple existing power structures and forge a major shift in the way we will live in the 21st century"  Is that not what the Tea Party started as.  Didn't the Tea Party originally want to kick out the ruling class in Washington and bring us back to our founding principles.  That would require the toppling of the exisiting power structure and forging a major shift in the way our country runs when compared to the last hundred years or so. 

 

Yes I think the protestors are misguided and on the wrong path but Amanda, Douglas, and myself have all said that the Tea Party should have been the ones that guided this movement and steered it towards constitutional principles.  These kids are pissed at some of the same things that started the Tea Party they may not understand it on the same level but the anger that started the Tea Party has fueled this movement and it has been allowed to be steered towards anti-capitalism and hate the rich.  Just a thought I'm sure I'll be called communist and marxist but I know who I am and what I am and it is neither of those two things.

Comment by JL Gawlik on October 7, 2011 at 1:14pm

@Steve Tikas 

I was not hurling insults to people, by making the statement of 'useful idiots', i was stating a historical fact. If you took it as insult that is your problem. I am merely pointing out what Karl Marx, Communist, Socialism is about and how they use people like Cloward and Piven, Alinsky, Van Jones, even the current President. The people on Wall Street are clearly being used by the groups cited earlier and many of them are 'useful idiots' for obvious reasons.

For you to bring in race is very foolish. No one here brought that up but you felt the need to inject it here. Everyone who TRULY believes in our Founding Fathers' Charters of Liberty and Freedom believe it for every USA citizen, period. This whole class warfare is the same thing. Very divisional.

IF you had read all of my statements you would have seen I am against crony capitalism. I am really fed up with the posters here who like the Progressives, like the present President 'picks and chooses' what statements they go after instead of looking at the whole picture.

Our country is on the verge of being taken over by TYRANNY, period.

Comment by amanda choate on October 7, 2011 at 1:06pm

One more thing William...

These young folks are the same young folks, "our children and grandchildren" that we say we care about when we talk about the debt crisis. Yet when these very same "children and grandchildren" begin to make a fuss and try to elucidate their needs and wants, we deride them. Thugs, hippies, brainwashed,spoiled brats, elites, commies. Is that what we think of our children and grandchildren. It is their generation that has been fighting a war for the last ten years. It is their generation who is goingto have to pay for that war. It is their generation that will have to pay the bills we felt were too much for us to bear. It is they who now look over a landscape of a nation that says we can't afford schools, roads, energy,  transportation, social programs, education demands, a middle class way of life. But here is the bill, thanks, have a nice day.

I am personally embarassed to live this country to them in this condition.
As a metaphor, if I left my hotel room in the same condition as we are leaving this country, I would leave a tip not blame the maid.

Comment by JL Gawlik on October 7, 2011 at 1:00pm

From reading the comments, i can now clearly see who are progressives on this blog.

What is so sad to see is Americans lying to other Americans to achieve a goal that will destroy our country period. 

That is unconscionable in my opinion.  

Democracy is mass majority rules, period. Which can be easily manipulated by mass hysteria.

Constitutional Republic is a government OF, BY and FOR the people, a country of laws created by the people.

Democracies have always failed, that is why our Founding Fathers created a Constitutional Republic, separation of Powers, that has been perverted, abused for almost a hundred years now, we have not completely been a government of what our foundation is because of dishonorable, dishonest, immoral, unethical, unconscionable elected representatives serving in the peoples' seats. And it is very clear now who the enemies within our own government and our own country truly are.

In 2012, the majority of the American people will change that fact and get our country back to our foundation, prosperity, liberty and freedom.

Comment by Bob Honiker on October 7, 2011 at 12:52pm

This essay says it well, better than I can..

 

The Latest Batch Of Useful Idiots           The protest that began as Occupy Wall Street is spreading to cities across the nation. But what isn't spreading is awareness of what the participants are protesting for. After numerous media interviews of people who are unable to articulate why they're there or what they want, many are writing off the movement as silly or even a failure. But could protest for protest's sake without any specific grievance be the plan? Could the impossibility for government, Wall Street or any other actual entity to address the unrest mean success because unrest is in fact the goal?
Whether one believes this is a grass roots movement or 'astroturf', there is no denying that social media has played a large part in the organization of the participants. That also means it would be quite simple to arm the protestors with a list of easy to remember and easy to understand 'talking points' that explain the goal of the movement and how they believe the protesting will help them achieve that goal.
Certainly the leaders of Occupy Whatever, whether they are devoted believers or professional organizers, can't be pleased with the portrayal of their foot soldiers as ignorant and unwashed slackers who just want to interfere with city operations and take up city resources for no purpose. Unless of course that is their purpose.
As coverage of the occupiers has increased, both the media and the American people are acting as if it is their responsibility to understand what has not been explained by the participants. We keep searching for some reasonable grievance because we know that we would not waste our time protesting unless we had a reasonable grievance.
But instead of intellectual empathy, what we should be applying to this situation is historical perspective. These protesters-without-a-clue are the same brand of individuals that first prompted the creation of the phrase 'useful idiots'. Throughout the Cold War, people without a full understanding of the communist system and its proponents' motivations were manipulated by those proponents into unwittingly supporting their cause. The anti-capitalism (and usually anti-American) message is often so muddled by this particular type of idiot that the audience is left unsure of exactly what the message is and where it originated. Sound like any current movement sweeping the nation?
Of one wants to, it's not difficult to trace the origins of Occupy Whatever to Adbusters; an organization with the self-proclaimed aim to "topple existing power structures and forge a major shift in the way we will live in the 21st century." Yet the mainstream media continues to portray this movement as "the liberal flip side of the tea party;" enticing mainstream liberals such as organized labor and students to join in. And what a useful batch of idiots they are turning out to be.

 

http://www.talkingsides.com/blogs/2011/10/07/the-latest-batch-of-us...

Comment by Steve Tikas on October 7, 2011 at 12:51pm

Why are they a mob here is the definition of a mob "A large crowd of people, esp. one that is disorderly and intent on causing trouble or violence." They to this point have not had the intent on causing trouble or violence.  The only violence has been against them.  And the biggest trouble is people getting to and from work.  I wouldn't classify that as a mob by definition.

 

The Koch brothers are dirty businessman that are backing the Tea Party and they were brought in because others mentioned how Soros and Van Jones are backing the OWS movement.  Here is an article about them http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/koch-industries-report-reveals-secret....  There are a lot more if you look. 

 

Mr. Clark you ask who people's political theorist are while at the same time demonizing the 'mob' for being mindless and not having a thought of their own.  Why do we need a political theorist why not just have a mind of our own.  I think if anything the Constitution should be our political theorist since that is the law of the land.

 

Why is Patricia a patriot but Amanda is not?  In case you are not sure Patriotism is defined as "love of country and willingness to sacrifice for it" what in Amanda's statement makes her not a patriot.  Are people only patriots when they agree with your position.  I have not heard Amanda say anything that would make her Marxist she has said plenty of things that you guys might not agree with but nothing that makes her Marxist.  She hasn't even really defending the OWS movement for the most part she has just pointed out the hypocrisy of the right and the Tea Party in relation to the movement.  

 

 

Comment by amanda choate on October 7, 2011 at 12:48pm

William those are all valid questions and I will do my best to respond.

Do you really admire marxism as they say they do?

I have absolutely no admiration for Marxism.

Do you admire the anti semitism of one of their thugs baiting an old Jewish gentleman?

I abhor racism, anti-semitism, sexism, all the isms. If one of these protestors said that he should be ashamed. Reach out to others with whom you disagree and find common ground.

Please share what words of wisdom you have heard from that crowd if you can.

We are the 99 percent. We are getting kicked out of our homes. We are forced to choose between groceries and rent. We are denied quality medical care. We are suffering from environmental pollution. We are working long hours for little pay and no rights, if we're working at all. We are getting nothing while the other 1 percent is getting everything. We are the 99 percent.

But this guy said it best:

http://www.milkandcookies.com/link/270201/detail/

What do the Koch brothers have to do with this discussion?

Well the Koch brothers fund the Tea Party, so if as an orginization you are damned by association, there is no one and I do mean no one who is more closely associated to the the Tea Party than they and yet when they profit from selling their products to our enemies nobody here makes a move to disassociate from them or hold them accountable. If we fail to do that, then we lose are position of moral superiority.

Hope that does it for you William.

 

Comment by Douglas Newberry on October 7, 2011 at 12:47pm

I support the founding fathers... I support the charters of freedom, I support liberty and justice for all.

Sadly... wing nuts on the right think the constitution is a conservative document. The constitution is a liberal document in that it lays a framework for you to live your life as YOU choose.

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